An American grammar question (totally off topic)

[tomgallagher]

Tom and Dick and Harry and Paul and John and Sam and Bill ate at the Olive Garden.

Tom, Dick, Harry, Paul, John, Sam and Bill ate at the Olive Garden.

[MikeM]

Yes, T to the E to the R, S, E.

Back when newspapers were paper, they had to worry about the size of headlines. That led to all sorts conventions like the one you mention. Ever notice the use of short words like "tots" instead of "children" and stuff like that?

[Chavster]

Tom and Dick and Harry and Paul and John and Sam and Bill ate at the Olive Garden.

Tom, Dick, Harry, Paul, John, Sam and Bill ate at the Olive Garden.

But Tom, that bears no relation to what I'm talking about.

I'm talking about TWO PEOPLE, or TWO THINGS, not a whole string of them.

Obviously if you're talking about 23,000 people, you're going to use a comma, rather than 'and' in between each one.

[Chavster]

Yes, T to the E to the R, S, E.

Back when newspapers were paper, they had to worry about the size of headlines. That led to all sorts conventions like the one you mention. Ever notice the use of short words like "tots" instead of "children" and stuff like that?

That doesnt explain why OBAMA, BUSH is used rather than OBAMA & BUSH though. I agree about space, but the size difference between , and & is utterly minute.

[MikeM]

Yes it does and no it isn't.

<= MikeM, sons in Central Park
<= MikeM & sons in Central Park
<= MikeM and his children in Central Park

Even pull a stunt like setting the text in Times Roman or something else designed to cram a lot of text into narrow columns.

[Chavster]

Oh. I wonder why newspapers all over the English speaking world, with the possible exception of those in Canada, dont do the same thing. Maybe they had wider sheets of paper

[Chavster]

Anyway it doesnt matter, I was just curious Its one of those little peculiarities that makes America, America! A little like 'awesome' and just about everyone loving Oprah for some unknown reason.

I'm going to get some dinner. See you all later 

[tomgallagher]

Tom and Dick and Harry and Paul and John and Sam and Bill ate at the Olive Garden.

Tom, Dick, Harry, Paul, John, Sam and Bill ate at the Olive Garden.

But Tom, that bears no relation to what I'm talking about.

I'm talking about TWO PEOPLE, or TWO THINGS, not a whole string of them.

Obviously if you're talking about 23,000 people, you're going to use a comma, rather than 'and' in between each one.

Oh OK, so this is the rule of two. I didn't know that. I'll have to check out The Guardian to see exactly  what you mean.

[Chavster]

Well check out my opening post, and you'll see the example I gave.

Obviously if you have lots of people going for spaghetti, you wouldnt say Sue and John and Daisy and Margaret and Bill and Dan and Tarquin... but if there's only two people, I dont get the comma thing.

As I said, it doesnt matter, its just a little bit of fun

[tomgallagher]

Well check out my opening post, and you'll see the example I gave.

Obviously if you have lots of people going for spaghetti, you wouldnt say Sue and John and Daisy and Margaret and Bill and Dan and Tarquin... but if there's only two people, I dont get the comma thing.

As I said, it doesnt matter, its just a little bit of fun

Right, we'll leave it at you just don't get it.

[Chavster]

I dont know why you're feeling the need to be so antagonistic and snotty today. One day you're like chalk, the next you're like cheese. One day up, one day down. One day pleasant, one day sour. Maybe there's a reason for that, but thankfully I dont need to be surrounded by it in person.

[tomgallagher]

While we are on the subject of grammar, American or otherwise, what does "Bollocks" mean in Brit speak.

[Razor X]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bollocks

[Mikekoz13]

I come with the truth on this topic.........

Most of the mainstream media in the USA is a bunch of pompous, bloated know it alls that think they know more than the general citizenry. In reality they are a bunch of barely educated sheep. You won't see that type of nonsense coming from well educated Americans.

[Blitzed]

Yes, T to the E to the R, S, E.

Back when newspapers were paper, they had to worry about the size of headlines. That led to all sorts conventions like the one you mention. Ever notice the use of short words like "tots" instead of "children" and stuff like that?

Exactly plus in the day when type was set by hand,  typesetters had learned by instinct how many letters would fit on a line.  Also to endlessly insert an "and" between two names makes it more difficult to read. We tend to forget that diacritical markings, such as commas, exist to give a nuance in the reader's mind as to how the line they are reading would actually sound.