Sly Bald Guys Forum

Head Shaving, Grooming & Care => Beards => Topic started by: Daven on June 19, 2011, 05:09:07 PM

Title: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Daven on June 19, 2011, 05:09:07 PM
MOST people call Van Dyke's a Goatee but a true goatee has no mustache. I think it was in the 70's that the term Van Dyke fell away, not sure why.

I have had facial hair for 15 years. In the summer it's a van dyke (goatee) and the winter full beard. Until yesterday I had side burns too, but since I shaved, those are gone now too. 

it will be interesting this winter when I grow out the beard with no hair, but I'm sure it will look good. 

So, who has what? 

yeah yeah, I know, you prefer to call a van dyke a goatee, which is totally cool, I think if you told someone you had a van dyke or were growing one they would be like "what?". 
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: TheSlyBear on June 19, 2011, 05:39:28 PM
Actually, you are not the only one who calls it a Van Dyke. I always have.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on June 19, 2011, 05:47:44 PM
Full, but trimmed.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: sailor61 on June 19, 2011, 06:22:20 PM
full but trimmed, though only Oct through April of each year
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: -Doug- on June 20, 2011, 06:27:05 AM
Full beard, but closely trimmed, like in my avatar picture.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: zetaeffe on June 20, 2011, 11:29:00 AM
Van dyke, but most of time with with some beard as I shave about once a week...
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: buddha on June 20, 2011, 04:18:28 PM
Van Dyke here.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Yakangler on June 23, 2011, 09:20:53 PM
Full beard the last 2 months, but I'm apt to shave down to a goatee often....rarely a clean shaven face.  Don't let my beard get too out-of-hand, but I'm feeling a little more bold the older I get.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: jp_bald on June 23, 2011, 10:59:23 PM
I love the mustache!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: BillOnBass on June 23, 2011, 11:17:44 PM
<----- Have the goatee as seen in my profile pic.  I'm in the process of growing it.  Not necessarily longer (I like the length as is), but spreading it out to cover more surface.  I'd love to try out a full beard and really get it growing big but I've never been able to go past three weeks.  Too many spots are just patchy and sparse on my neck and no hair grows on my cheeks; just doesn't look good at all.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: beardedbaldgerman on June 24, 2011, 01:16:00 AM
Looking good with that mustache, jp_bald
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: FR8TRAIN on June 24, 2011, 02:46:35 PM
I'm currently clean shaven but I normally sport a neat, closely trimmed VanDyke. My most recent chin dressing was a nice goatee.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: philp on June 25, 2011, 06:04:26 AM
Full beard but closely trimmed, let it go a bit more in winter
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: -Doug- on June 27, 2011, 09:12:01 AM
Full beard, but closely trimmed, like in my avatar picture.

Updated: Changed it to a Van Dyke.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-HnCDDYi-ZLs/TgibBGyClyI/AAAAAAAAAf8/LicMcTmyRDA/s288/delete1.jpg) (https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-yXiGw91foyA/TgibBHzEUYI/AAAAAAAAAf4/fYT7K-ZUBM8/s288/delete2.jpg)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Razor X on June 27, 2011, 06:49:40 PM
Looks good!   O0
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: marshd1000 on June 27, 2011, 08:43:53 PM
Currently I have a full "Mountain Man" type of beard!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: joergHH on June 28, 2011, 01:29:13 AM
Van Dyke.  O0

J
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: CraftyGuy on June 28, 2011, 07:29:02 AM
Van Dyke most of the time, but I'm inclined to grow it out full in the winter (and when I'm feeling lazy)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Cochise on June 28, 2011, 08:12:36 AM
My beard style changes with the weather
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Coltsfan73 on July 05, 2011, 08:15:18 AM
full beard here too
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Oracle on July 05, 2011, 09:23:56 AM
I have sported some kind of :D facial hair for the past 27 years.  I have been wearing a very closely trimmed goatee for the last 10.  There's too much grey to wear a full beard but it isn't bad in the goatee if I keep it trimmed.  By the way, I have earned each and every one of those grey hair and I am proud of   them.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: slybronco on July 05, 2011, 09:25:10 AM
Goatee here.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: mrzed on July 11, 2011, 08:50:11 PM
I"ve had a full beard since 1980.  Keep it trimmed to about 1/2 inch length.

I'm not balding, but I currently cut my hair to 1/16 inch, so it's pretty short.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: justinlane on July 11, 2011, 09:44:48 PM
Starting to grow a Goatee
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Razorhead on July 26, 2011, 05:34:47 AM
Most of the time a Van Dyke. But i'll also sport just a mustache when I want a more cleaner look. Lately I've been seeing more guys sporting mustaches with their shaved heads. anyone else seeing the same?
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Razor X on July 26, 2011, 03:35:58 PM
Lately I've been seeing more guys sporting mustaches with their shaved heads. anyone else seeing the same?

No.  I hardly ever see anyone wearing just a mustache anymore.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Arnie on July 27, 2011, 04:07:15 PM
I wanted to sport a beard for a business trip and succeeded sort of.  My picture is a little misleading because it is just hours before I got it trimmed.

But now I'm back to the VanDyke. 8)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: jimbo48 on July 27, 2011, 07:49:02 PM
Full but trimmed
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: xnewyawka on July 28, 2011, 12:23:50 PM
Most of the time it's a true goatee, but I will alternate that with a Van Dyke.
During the Winter months (yes, we have them in AZ, lol), I grow out a beard, which I will change the look of as well.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: 1GoZoom on August 15, 2011, 11:07:54 PM
I call it a goatee and am growing one for the moment, but am probably going to forgo that and grow a beard following the chin line.  I always look better like that.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: tmgrood on August 16, 2011, 05:28:38 AM
Goat...............as my wife calls it. Oh wait, it's me she calls goat. Old Goat.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: DaleBlankenship on August 17, 2011, 04:27:22 PM
Since I started being able to grow facial hair nearly 20 years ago I've only gone without some kind of facial hair for maybe 2 weeks total.  And those 2 weeks are spread out over 1 or 2 days at a time where I'd take the razor over my entire face.  I think men without some type of facial hair look goofy... no offense to those here without facial hair.

Right now I have a full beard, about half an inch long or so.  I tend to let it grow out pretty thick for a few months then trim it with clippers like in my picture, which was taken shortly after I trimmed. 
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Rusty Shackleford on August 18, 2011, 09:12:12 AM
Goatee (sorry, I'm not going to call it a "Van Dyke")

I've had it pretty much for 17 years with a few of those years having a beard.  I really don't like a beard because my face isn't round enough so it just doesn't look right.  I also get tired of hair growing out of the side of my face.

I'm currently going for length and the longest hairs are now about 6.5" long.  I normally keep it rolled up so that the length isn't seen.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: baldjoeg on August 18, 2011, 10:52:12 PM

I have a Van Dyke and like the looks of it with a bald head. I groom it and keep it trimmed pretty short
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Razor X on August 20, 2011, 03:51:10 PM
I normally keep it rolled up so that the length isn't seen.

Why?
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: xnewyawka on August 24, 2011, 01:28:24 PM
I normally keep it rolled up so that the length isn't seen.

Why?

Yes, and why don't you post a pic as well?
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Peacemaker on September 06, 2011, 12:36:27 PM
Tried the Van Dyke once but it made me look like some country bumpkin. I could never pull off or even desire to grow a "molestache"  ;D and I dropped the goatee after high school because it's very cliché and seems "douchie" amongst my peers.   I just sport a clean 5 o'clock shadow, sort of like Jason Statham. I dig it and most importantly my girl digs it so that's what it'll be for a while.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Krimson on November 17, 2011, 05:58:27 PM
most people call it a Zappa
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: bbc2012 on December 05, 2011, 03:10:05 PM
Full beard, sometimes trimmed
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: mrzed on December 05, 2011, 04:05:42 PM
full beard since 1980.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: xnewyawka on December 05, 2011, 05:27:37 PM
Goatee, Van Dyke, and beard as well. I change my look with these every so often, but mostly defer to the true goat.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Sir Harry on December 05, 2011, 06:12:42 PM
Chinstrap most of the time (of course I have to shave it for drill weekends) I may go back to the goatee next time I grow it out...personally I think thick or handlebar moustaches are better with shaved heads than a thin moustache
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Sly Tlee-Wierd on December 07, 2011, 02:01:13 AM
A Frank Zappa with a straight mustache (probably will be the next pic I post)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Paul the Headblader on December 07, 2011, 02:40:53 AM
I'm trying to grow a full beard here too :)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Laser Man on December 07, 2011, 09:14:44 AM
A van Dyke (moustache and goatee) since late September.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: mangosink12572 on December 08, 2011, 11:24:52 AM
VanDyke  - - - and I enjoy it ALMOST as much as my BALD noggin.

I started growing it  almost a month ago.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: DCdome on December 08, 2011, 11:31:06 AM
I'm in the same situation as Mango and have similar feelings toward my bald dome and facial hair.  My beard is maybe a couple of weeks older than his.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: ElecEngineer on December 08, 2011, 12:09:00 PM
Not sure what it's called, but I have my mustache that extends down to my chin, kinda like Paul Sr.'s beard from OCC, only thinner
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Kres7787 on December 16, 2011, 04:40:21 AM
Always end up with goatee...

Cool mustaches jp_bald  O0
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: baldjoeg on December 17, 2011, 10:53:21 PM
Looks great Mango and DCdome.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: ycartt on December 30, 2011, 09:25:28 PM
Van Dyke here.  Just not shown in my picture.  Sure cuts down on the face shaving time by not having to shave that little bit...spend that time on the dome.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: NESTYdPOGI on January 02, 2012, 12:15:45 AM
I think mine is VANDYKE... I sported this look 2 months ago... Here in my picture, it's 5-day old vandyke. Great day to all of us bald and good looking guys
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Slynito on January 02, 2012, 05:58:26 AM
The Van Dyke and shaved head looks good on you. Welcome to the forum, Nesty and all the best in 2012.

 O0
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: NESTYdPOGI on January 02, 2012, 08:30:25 PM
Thanks Slynito and Happy New Year to you and your loved ones...  O0 more power to you brother!!!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: imaginary on February 09, 2012, 03:42:36 PM
Full beard. Ironically, when I had hair on the top of my head, I kept the beard short. Now that I am bald, I've let the beard grow a little longer.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: HeadbladerBob on February 20, 2012, 08:29:55 PM
looking good out there
Title: Re: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: bamsbbq on February 21, 2012, 02:36:48 AM
Ok I read this thread from newest to oldest post...on my phone. Lol

So I had to Google van dyke. I sport a stash & goatee, trying to get some length to this before the missus tells me to trim it because it is multicolored now ;)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Paul the Headblader on February 21, 2012, 11:12:55 AM
full beard here(easily visible )
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: ProphetNoir on February 22, 2012, 11:36:46 AM
Since I separate them, I guess I am sporting a goatee and a pencil 'stache.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Razor X on February 22, 2012, 07:00:53 PM
Is it just my imagination or are full beards back in a big way?  I'm seeing more of them on younger guys these days and less of the stache-less goatees that were very popular a year or two ago.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on February 22, 2012, 07:06:53 PM
Is it just my imagination or are full beards back in a big way? 
Yes, I sport one, don't I? >:D
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Razor X on February 22, 2012, 07:11:34 PM
Is it just my imagination or are full beards back in a big way? 
Yes, I sport one, don't I? >:D

Yes, my bad.  I forgot the whole trend was down to you.   ;)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: marshd1000 on February 22, 2012, 07:18:26 PM
I don't think it is your imagination Razor!  I have noticed it quite a bit here in Seattle.  But the other day I was in Portland, which I consider to be a hipster capital.  While I was there, I noticed a lot of younger guys with beards.  Also another interesting thing about Portland and maybe Oregon....the police officers are allowed to have full beards.  That is the only place I have seen that!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on February 22, 2012, 07:19:50 PM
Is it just my imagination or are full beards back in a big way? 
Yes, I sport one, don't I? >:D

Yes, my bad.  I forgot the whole trend was down to you.   ;)
;D  It's nice to think that way! :D
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: xnewyawka on February 23, 2012, 06:42:13 AM
It's not your imagination Razor, I've noticed it myself. I think it's a good thing, and about time.
I believe it has to do with men being sick and tired of the "metrosexual" approach to grooming shoved down our throats. Couple that with some celebs and musicians now sporting beards, and you have a new trend.
Does that mean our goatee's are now out?!   ;)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on February 23, 2012, 07:21:11 AM
Does that mean our goatee's are now out?!   ;)

Nope, it's just further evidence that there are more and more choices that are moving into the mainstream for facial hair. 
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: TheSlyBear on February 23, 2012, 09:23:50 AM
Does that mean our goatee's are now out?!   ;)
Oh I hope so! I'm so tired of being trendy!  8)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Razor X on February 23, 2012, 04:15:37 PM
Does that mean our goatee's are now out?!   ;)
Oh I hope so! I'm so tired of being trendy!  8)

I think they're out depending on what age group you're in.  I don't see many twentysomethings with circle beards/goatees/Van Dykes anymore but I still see plenty of them on guys who are 40 and up.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: marshd1000 on February 23, 2012, 11:41:27 PM
I must be getting old!  At this point, I don't care what is in or out!  I have had just a mustache when they were out and a beard when it was out.  Now I have a beard and they are in.  But I will probably do the mustache and Van Dyke in the future....or even just a mustache again!  It makes my bald head spin!  I guess I just don't care!  All I know is that I am a sly stud no matter what kind of facial hair I have!   :*)) ;D
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: ProphetNoir on February 24, 2012, 08:56:48 AM
@marshd1000.
The beard you are sporting in your avatar is a true miracle of nature.  I envy that and I will be saddened to see it go should you decide to change your style for any reason.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: marshd1000 on February 24, 2012, 02:40:44 PM
@marshd1000.
The beard you are sporting in your avatar is a true miracle of nature.  I envy that and I will be saddened to see it go should you decide to change your style for any reason.

Thanks for the affirmation!  Currently, I am still sporting a full beard.  But it is trimmed down!  I may grow it out to the mountain man length at some point!  But it is easier for me to grow hair on the face and other places than it is on my head!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Razor X on February 24, 2012, 07:12:03 PM
I must be getting old!  At this point, I don't care what is in or out!  I have had just a mustache when they were out and a beard when it was out.  Now I have a beard and they are in.  But I will probably do the mustache and Van Dyke in the future....or even just a mustache again!  It makes my bald head spin!  I guess I just don't care!  All I know is that I am a sly stud no matter what kind of facial hair I have!   :*)) ;D

I don't think it's getting old as much as reaching a certain level of maturity where you're secure enough to do what you what your comfortable with instead of being a slave to fashion. While no one should be the guy who's still wearing leisure suits, there does come a realization that you can't follow every trend that comes along. 
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on February 24, 2012, 07:23:58 PM
I'm trying to let mine grow out some--it's full now as I haven't shaved below the ears since August, 2010.  I had been trimming at a Wahl #4, but decided this January to take it out to a #6.  It's starting to catch some hair now and it is a little more wavy than I'm totally comfortable with, but I'll stick it out a little longer I think.  During this grow out for some reason I remembered a portrait of my great-grandfather that was at my grandfather's house.  It was done in the late 19th century and he had an absolutely huge beard trimmed in a hard straight line across his chest.  I was facinated by that picture as a child.  Only one relative, the husband of my Aunt had a beard that was anything like that big.   I don't know who in the family has that portrait but I'm going to find out, I want a copy made.  I don't think I could get away with doing a repeat of that beard with my wife, much less my employer, but it's something that may happen when I hit the lottery and retire. 

The main benefit so far of a full beard, blades last a really long time when they only have to shave what's left on the noggin. 
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Razor X on February 24, 2012, 07:48:00 PM

   I don't think I could get away with doing a repeat of that beard with my wife, much less my employer, but it's something that may happen when I hit the lottery and retire. 

So you're planning on doing what, exactly,  with the wife when you hit the lottery? >:D
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on February 24, 2012, 07:53:07 PM

   I don't think I could get away with doing a repeat of that beard with my wife, much less my employer, but it's something that may happen when I hit the lottery and retire. 

So you're planning on doing what, exactly,  with the wife when you hit the lottery? >:D
Well, I guess there are a lot of options, I win the lottery, you win the  :/O >:D
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: nuts on February 24, 2012, 08:09:25 PM
I don't know about the rest of Australia but in the capital Canberra there are lots of older men (say over 55) with beards.  I did a quick survey at my gym where us seniors go before noon and about 50% have beards.  I was helping out at a stand at our local show yesterday which was 'seniors' day and again about 50% had beards.  And it was very hot at around 90 degrees Fahrenheit.

Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: 1GoZoom on May 01, 2012, 01:14:46 PM
I used to have the goatee as per my old post, but for the past 4 months or so, I've had a couple weeks' worth of beard.  Now I'm growing it out for about 6 weeks and will trim it back after and keep a little longer for the summer.

Going for a short boxed beard look.  Later this fall, I'll shave down to a Burt Reynolds mustache or the Magnum (Top Gun) mustache.  It takes a while to grow those.  :(

Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Tg96 on May 01, 2012, 01:47:13 PM
What style is this that I have exactly called?
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Natedawg on May 02, 2012, 12:49:44 PM
I suppose I fall into the 'van dyke' area... Obviously, I like to keep it full. No thin beards for me. 8) I would like to go full facial beard, but the growth on my cheeks is too sporadic.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Baldstu on May 02, 2012, 01:02:53 PM
What style is this that I have exactly called?


Looks like a goatee to me  TG
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: SalWalker on May 05, 2012, 02:04:38 PM
Full.  Sometimes trimmed.

Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: KDusk on May 05, 2012, 07:57:13 PM
Short trimmed full beard (between 1/4 and 1/2 inch). Not really a beard, but more than a 3 day stubble.

I have a question about the sideburns: where exactly do you stop shaving your head and does your beard start?
Above your ear, at the top of the ear, somewhere halfway the ear, at the bottom of the ear or below the ear?

I personally start my beard somewhere halfway my ear.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Sir Harry on May 05, 2012, 09:30:07 PM
When I wore a beard, mine usually started about the level of the ear canal.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Slyfive on May 06, 2012, 04:27:39 AM
I would keep mine to the top of the ear, but I have a weird band of missing hair at the ear canal level
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Vash on May 06, 2012, 05:53:15 AM
Full mustache & beard. I stopped shaving the day I found out my wife is pregnant with our first kid. 17 weeks in so far, Trimming/grooming only, until the kiddo arrives.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Natedawg on May 07, 2012, 07:37:40 AM
I have a question about the sideburns: where exactly do you stop shaving your head and does your beard start?
Above your ear, at the top of the ear, somewhere halfway the ear, at the bottom of the ear or below the ear?

I think it also depends on the person. I usually keep mine at the inside top of the ear, pretty much level with where sunglasses would sit.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Mr Jules on May 15, 2012, 03:17:25 PM
Still experimenting. Though the final shape will be determind by where there the beard grows best. There's little growth where the sideburns ought to be.

Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on May 15, 2012, 03:40:19 PM
At three weeks you really can't tell that much--wait at least 2 if not 3 months before any major decisions.  Patience is the key here. 
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: 1GoZoom on May 15, 2012, 04:56:27 PM
Decided to have a little fun and shaved down to a horseshoe mustache.  The 'Hulkamnia is gonna run wild on ya, brother!" style typically worn by bikers and hipsters.  Bahaha.

(https://www.slybaldguys.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FWebQx.jpg&hash=0dcc2bbd4fdfd88df11cda0a01e08b5a827d76dc)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Lynchy on May 16, 2012, 04:13:43 AM
Nice 1goZoom.....

Looking great!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: balddoc on May 16, 2012, 05:20:49 AM
Used to have a full beard when I still had hair, but trimmed it to a Van Dyke when I went sly. Full beard with bald melon somehow didn't suit me. A bare chin, however, suits me even less.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: sam2021 on May 17, 2012, 09:12:25 PM
I think I am going to try to grow a Fu Manchu.  like Kill Bill kung fu master.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: DJ_Bald on May 28, 2012, 07:25:50 AM
stubbly beard with a goattee--..shavingthe mustachepart of the goattee down to juststubble lately. Wife likes that better :)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Mr Jules on May 29, 2012, 12:07:58 PM
First time growing a beard. Nearly six weeks in. Think I will keep this look and not shave the chops on the side to make a goatee.

Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on May 29, 2012, 01:05:51 PM
First time growing a beard. Nearly six weeks in. Think I will keep this look and not shave the chops on the side to make a goatee.



Good choice, that's a great growth for 6 weeks--Mother Nature is telling you to keep the full beard look. 
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Mr Jules on May 29, 2012, 01:44:13 PM
Good choice, that's a great growth for 6 weeks--Mother Nature is telling you to keep the full beard look. 

Thank you. When I went bald, I was bit an anxious. Though everyone adjusted to the new look soon enough. That was nearly 4 months ago.

I started growing the beard to see how it would appear with the sly look. I've not been fishing for compliment, yet everyone likes it. Like you say, mother nature is telling me something.



Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Rusty Shackleford on May 29, 2012, 02:29:07 PM
I've got a long goatee that has hairs measuring over 12"!  I usually keep it rolled up to look like a mortal goatee but it's fun to unleash on weekends!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: xabydaddy on May 29, 2012, 07:01:17 PM
Van Dyke ( I call it a Goatee, incorrectly obviously). Had a full beard while in college and the goatee for the past 20 years. M
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: marshd1000 on May 29, 2012, 11:56:21 PM
I've got a long goatee that has hairs measuring over 12"!  I usually keep it rolled up to look like a mortal goatee but it's fun to unleash on weekends!

Hey buddy, are we ever going to see your actual sly self?  Just wondering!   :o
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Natedawg on May 30, 2012, 08:05:18 AM
I've got a long goatee that has hairs measuring over 12"!  I usually keep it rolled up to look like a mortal goatee but it's fun to unleash on weekends!

Hey buddy, are we ever going to see your actual sly self?  Just wondering!   :o

Yeah, I gotta see pics of that thing. Longest I ever grew mine was too my collar bone, and that was too long for me.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Rusty Shackleford on May 30, 2012, 10:52:00 AM
The other day I took some self photos as I was getting ready to run in a 5K zombie run (it was at night, was in the woods, had obstacles, and people dressed as zombies attempted to steal the two flags that the runners wore)

(https://www.slybaldguys.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi220.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fdd209%2FScuba_Steve1974%2FIMG_0552.jpg&hash=c06a632796479348576ab1e6f0796dae64b7f0c3)

I ended up tying it up because I wanted it under control for the run:

(https://www.slybaldguys.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi220.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fdd209%2FScuba_Steve1974%2FIMG_0557.jpg&hash=cfd33fed939613b45d03ea716efb704e495050f0)


This is what I look like today:

(https://www.slybaldguys.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi220.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fdd209%2FScuba_Steve1974%2FIMG_0565.jpg&hash=ff8a281ec4b71e8eec31d7630564a46d77e266eb)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on May 30, 2012, 11:22:28 AM
The last shot, trimmed or tied up?  If that's tied up, it is a very neat and skilled accomplishment O0.  I'd be very tempted to go long if I could make that kind of daily adjustment! 
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Mr Jules on May 30, 2012, 11:28:18 AM
This is what I look like today:
(https://www.slybaldguys.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi220.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fdd209%2FScuba_Steve1974%2FIMG_0565.jpg&hash=ff8a281ec4b71e8eec31d7630564a46d77e266eb)

Agree with Saintc - That is a fine beard and well trimmed.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Natedawg on May 30, 2012, 12:36:57 PM
Excellent beard in all forms, Rusty! Also, a zombie run sounds awesome.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Rusty Shackleford on May 30, 2012, 12:48:36 PM
The last shot, trimmed or tied up?  If that's tied up, it is a very neat and skilled accomplishment O0.  I'd be very tempted to go long if I could make that kind of daily adjustment! 

Yea that's it tied up.  It's funny when I'm around people used to seeing me one way when they see me the other.  The ones who usually see it at full length almost always ask me why I cut it while people who are used to seeing it rolled up tend to be shocked at the length.  That's one of the reasons I know it really is accomplishing its goal of looking like a legitimate short goatee.   I think the rolled up short goatee makes a better short goatee than when the hairs are actually cut short.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Rusty Shackleford on May 30, 2012, 12:51:30 PM
Yeah, I gotta see pics of that thing. Longest I ever grew mine was too my collar bone, and that was too long for me.


What made you cut it off?  Judging by the look of your avatar it looks like it must have been a monster.  I know when it's long it can become a burden: it blows around in the wind because hair has a lot of surface area and no weight whatsoever.  It can also be annoying when I sleep because it will be caught under my side or arm when I try to move.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: -Doug- on May 30, 2012, 12:55:27 PM
That's an IMPRESSIVE tying up job. It looks like it is trimmed.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on May 30, 2012, 01:03:40 PM
I think the rolled up short goatee makes a better short goatee than when the hairs are actually cut short.
Certainly gives a great appearance of density at the shorter length.  At about what length were you able to start tying it up for control?  I'm asking because we have a "neatly trimmed" policy at the office and I wonder if I could get to a length I could accomplish that and still be office "legal?"  And, if it can be described without an instructional video, how do you tie it?  
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Natedawg on May 30, 2012, 02:48:24 PM
What made you cut it off?

It was really dense/thick, so it would feel like it was getting in the way often. Plus, my facial hair gets wiry-looking if it gets long enough. There's probably some kind of product or technique I could have used to help all of the aforementioned, but meh, I'm a lazy man. I love how yours looks like an excellently styled goat when you roll it up. You got it down pat.   O:O
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Mr Jules on May 30, 2012, 03:14:56 PM
we have a "neatly trimmed" policy at the office and I wonder if I could get to a length I could accomplish that and still be office "legal?"  

In our office, I'm not aware of any beard policy. So I am wondering how much further I can grow my beard before somebody says something.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Lynchy on May 31, 2012, 05:00:33 AM
Rusty that beard is sweet!

I 'm asking because we have a "neatly trimmed" policy at the office and I wonder if I could get to a length I could accomplish that and still be office "legal?"  And, if it can be described without an instructional video, how do you tie it? 

I don't know how I feel about work dictating my facial hair?

Surely neat just means either in the process of growing a beard, or be clean shaven. To avoid lazies with a few days growth?
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: zetaeffe on May 31, 2012, 06:52:56 AM
WOW!! that's a great goatee!! I like it very much in any version, but expecially in the long untied one!  O0 O0 O0

Wish I could grow mine like yours!! Best compliments again, it's really a great look with the smooth head!!

The other day I took some self photos as I was getting ready to run in a 5K zombie run (it was at night, was in the woods, had obstacles, and people dressed as zombies attempted to steal the two flags that the runners wore)

(https://www.slybaldguys.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi220.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fdd209%2FScuba_Steve1974%2FIMG_0552.jpg&hash=c06a632796479348576ab1e6f0796dae64b7f0c3)

I ended up tying it up because I wanted it under control for the run:

(https://www.slybaldguys.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi220.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fdd209%2FScuba_Steve1974%2FIMG_0557.jpg&hash=cfd33fed939613b45d03ea716efb704e495050f0)


This is what I look like today:

(https://www.slybaldguys.com/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi220.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fdd209%2FScuba_Steve1974%2FIMG_0565.jpg&hash=ff8a281ec4b71e8eec31d7630564a46d77e266eb)

Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Rusty Shackleford on May 31, 2012, 08:48:36 AM
I think the rolled up short goatee makes a better short goatee than when the hairs are actually cut short.
Certainly gives a great appearance of density at the shorter length.  At about what length were you able to start tying it up for control?  I'm asking because we have a "neatly trimmed" policy at the office and I wonder if I could get to a length I could accomplish that and still be office "legal?"  And, if it can be described without an instructional video, how do you tie it?  

I didn't start doing this until I got some length to it, so I'm gonna guess that it would need to be 2"-3" in length before my technique would work.  It requires enough length to make a ponytail on the bottom that is not tight against the chin.  I make minor tweaks to the technique periodically, but right now what I did was create a smaller ponytail on the bottom with a band tight against the skin and then a main ponytail with all of the bulk.  I use a small zip tie that anchors the tiedown to the base of the original ponytail.  I made a thread about this at http://jefffsbeardboard.yuku.com/topic/15646/Hiding-the-length-of-a-long-goatee (http://jefffsbeardboard.yuku.com/topic/15646/Hiding-the-length-of-a-long-goatee).
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on May 31, 2012, 09:23:34 AM
I didn't start doing this until I got some length to it, so I'm gonna guess that it would need to be 2"-3" in length before my technique would work.  It requires enough length to make a ponytail on the bottom that is not tight against the chin. 
Thanks O0, you've given me something to think about.  Now, how to let my full beard grow out to the necessary length and observe the office mandate and see if I can adapt your method?  I've seen Sikhs who have done something like it will full beards, but they often have a "tied" look and I suspect a lot goes under the turban--I ain't going there! ;D
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: baldjoeg on May 31, 2012, 04:41:50 PM
Rusty,

You have a great looking thick Van Dyke. I really like the look of the shorter one that you siad you have now. Wish mine would grow a little thicker. I groom mine regularly.

 ;) ;)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Rusty Shackleford on May 31, 2012, 11:56:35 PM
Rusty,

You have a great looking thick Van Dyke. I really like the look of the shorter one that you siad you have now. Wish mine would grow a little thicker. I groom mine regularly.

 ;) ;)

I'm not sure if you got it but the short one IS the long one.  The "short" one is just the long one with the goatee rolled up to give the appearance of a short goatee.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: marshd1000 on June 01, 2012, 08:49:21 AM
Rusty, I am very impressed with the goatee.  I personally think long facial hair looks very cool with the bald noggin.  But you do a great job in making it look short too!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Slyfive on June 01, 2012, 04:21:30 PM
Hey Rusty, I had a brainwave, what I'd you plaited some stiff wire inside one of the braids, it would be a hidden twisty tie! You wouldn't need and cable ties or band and it would be hidden in your hair
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Razor X on June 01, 2012, 07:17:25 PM
I think the rolled up short goatee makes a better short goatee than when the hairs are actually cut short.
Certainly gives a great appearance of density at the shorter length.  At about what length were you able to start tying it up for control?  I'm asking because we have a "neatly trimmed" policy at the office and I wonder if I could get to a length I could accomplish that and still be office "legal?"  And, if it can be described without an instructional video, how do you tie it?  

I didn't start doing this until I got some length to it, so I'm gonna guess that it would need to be 2"-3" in length before my technique would work.  It requires enough length to make a ponytail on the bottom that is not tight against the chin.  I make minor tweaks to the technique periodically, but right now what I did was create a smaller ponytail on the bottom with a band tight against the skin and then a main ponytail with all of the bulk.  I use a small zip tie that anchors the tiedown to the base of the original ponytail.  I made a thread about this at http://jefffsbeardboard.yuku.com/topic/15646/Hiding-the-length-of-a-long-goatee (http://jefffsbeardboard.yuku.com/topic/15646/Hiding-the-length-of-a-long-goatee).

It's an ingenious solution, to be sure.  Too bad that it takes so long to grow out to a length that can actually be tied up.  Otherwise, more of us might be inclined to try it.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: antoniom on June 11, 2012, 08:12:35 AM
I have mustache right now i tend to keep on but have it trimmed or some hair under my chin i wore a bread before but cut it into chin straps so it looks like i have a line of hair going around my face maaybe clean all over but i look younger that way.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Beardman on June 12, 2012, 06:16:10 AM
I am sporting a neck length Van Dyke, I did have an extra 2 inches on it until about a month ago when I knocked it back to try and get some extra density to it, I wouldn't mind getting it as long as Rusty's in the future though! I couldn't deal with a company with strict facial hair policies like it seems some of you have... I love my facial hair nice and long
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Rusty Shackleford on June 15, 2012, 11:22:35 AM
I am sporting a neck length Van Dyke, I did have an extra 2 inches on it until about a month ago when I knocked it back to try and get some extra density to it, I wouldn't mind getting it as long as Rusty's in the future though! I couldn't deal with a company with strict facial hair policies like it seems some of you have... I love my facial hair nice and long

Cool man you should post a picture.  We long goateed guys are a rare breed: guys either have them short or go with a full beard if they want to go long.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Mr Jules on June 15, 2012, 01:59:12 PM
Partly inspired by some of the guys here on SBG, going for a longer beard hanging off the chin.

The other day, the barber trimmed and shaped my beard and also suggested a longer V shape beard, too.

Reckon I'm a month or so away from that final beard shape.

Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on June 15, 2012, 02:25:34 PM
Letting a beard grow out can really get "interesting."  Don't get discouraged and reach for the scissors or worse, the clipper, if the face fur starts kicking up with some curls, etc.  My experience is that at some point, the natural wave and curl and the appropriate length all come together.  But, and this is where that 48 hour wait caution applies, between where you are now and where you'll ultimately be can go through some pretty rough looking--at least to yourself in the mirror--territory.  Just keep in mind, we often only see the beard as individual hairs.  Everyone else by in large just sees the beard--and yours in definately moving on to a good place. 
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: imaginary on June 15, 2012, 07:21:36 PM
Saintc, I totally agree. I first grew a beard back in 2010, and suffice to say, it was a major change for me. It affected me physically, emotionally, and psychologically (long, deep story on the latter.) The bigger part of the change was the fact I was working overnight, and I reappeared in the daytime with a beard. I'm thankful for the beardboard at that time for their support. Although I shaved it off, not only do I still miss the beard, the time was something I'll never forget.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: jagurin on June 21, 2012, 12:55:56 PM
i useally keep a trim van dyke. but i expremant with diffrent kinds all the time tho most people tend to like the beard and tailback van dyke.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: mopar400 on June 23, 2012, 04:36:07 PM
Long Van Dyke here......
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Mr Jules on June 24, 2012, 06:30:03 AM
Just keep in mind, we often only see the beard as individual hairs.  Everyone else by in large just sees the beard--and yours in definately moving on to a good place. 

Good point and thanks, Sainttc. Mind you, gotta to improve my drinking technique - the beard somehow seems collect a few drops of whatever I'm drinking.

Is that new profile pic with a bigger beard, there ?


Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on June 24, 2012, 06:41:05 AM
Is that new profile pic with a bigger beard, there ?
Yup, my faithful Wahl trimmer died--and I have to get another--meanwhile I'm letting it grow.  As long as I can maintain a "neatly trimmed" look for work, I'm thinking of going longer, maybe long enough to see if Rusty Shackleford's tie-up idea can be adapted somehow to a full beard and I can really go big.  Feels great in the wind with a half helmet on the my Harley--but I have to carry a comb to straighten it up after a ride. :D  Been a while since I've packed a comb in my back pocket! ;)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Beardman on June 25, 2012, 02:47:00 AM
Looking good Saintc, can't wait to see it at it's fullest!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: waine on June 25, 2012, 05:34:10 AM
I sport a moustache with the little tuft unfer the lip.  I am not allowed to grow a "Goatee" due to my work dress code, but if I were,  I would certainly grow a full goatee.  It pretty much sucks as I really want a goatee, so I have to wait for my vacation leave before I do that.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Sir Harry on June 25, 2012, 06:09:51 AM
Waine......As a Guardsman (soon to be retired), I can sympathize....I can't tell you how many times I've had to shave my beard or goatee when drill weekend/maneuvers came up....Since joining this site, I find it hard to walk around sly with just a moustache, so I cut it down to where it's barely showing...or if I'm really agitated I just go clean shaven. Post military career I definitely plan to carry a Van Dyke at the mininum. Saintc, nice beard! No offense, but if there were a "Sly Santa" contest, you would get my vote easily!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Mr Jules on June 30, 2012, 05:31:46 AM
Been a while since I've packed a comb in my back pocket! ;)

My comb is coming back into use now, too.

It's been years since there was any hair on my head which was this long.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Hingatao on June 30, 2012, 03:27:53 PM
No beard right now but I've thinking about letting my 'stache and goatee grow back. The only problem is they'd be grey so I'd probably want to dye them black to match my eyebrows.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Slyfive on June 30, 2012, 06:27:44 PM
It's been years since there was any hair on my head which was this long.

Jules, that beard is looking awesome, great shape!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: slagtdan on June 30, 2012, 09:23:54 PM
I'm doing a trimmed full beard right now, but thinking I need a change soon.  Never tried a longer beard though....scratching my sly
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Beardman on June 30, 2012, 09:56:47 PM
Long beards are where it is at, if my van dyke is less then a handful it just feels wrong to me these days haha
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Coltsfan73 on June 30, 2012, 11:21:45 PM
Saint & Jules .... Beards are looking great, men.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Mr Jules on July 01, 2012, 04:29:02 AM
Jules, that beard is looking awesome, great shape!

Thanks there Slyfive. Beard is taking on a life of its own now !
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on July 01, 2012, 10:04:37 AM
So far I haven't gotten out to replace my trimmer--so "The Growth Goes On!"  Lots of waves showing up. 
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Slyfive on July 01, 2012, 11:49:34 PM
So far I haven't gotten out to replace my trimmer--so "The Growth Goes On!"  Lots of waves showing up. 

Can't wait to see it in full swing!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: waine on July 02, 2012, 12:28:04 AM
@Coltsfan

Wow, thats one big bushy beard there!  Awesome man!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: sfty.dude on July 08, 2012, 11:15:10 AM
Last week I cleaned my beard up into a nice little chin strap.  But most of the time I just let my beard grow fairly free.  I just shave my neck.  I have been wanting to get the handlebar look for my mustache but it hasn't grown quite as long or as thick as I would like.  My beard isn't as thick either but its gets thicker each time it grows back.

Right now though I am anxiously waiting for my beard to grow back, haha.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Mr Jules on July 08, 2012, 01:46:54 PM
Been growing my beard for about 2.5 months. I am carrying on, to see what happens...

Got to be more careful when eating, catching myself nibbling on stray whiskers around the mouth !!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on August 10, 2012, 09:07:40 AM
Trimmed back to 1".  Too many complaints from the wife about the growth at 2".  It was looking pretty sloppy, no matter what.  Although I could use a hair dryer to get some of the waves under control, the minute I went out in the heat and humidity it was friz city. The other big issue was on the HD with the full helmet--the airflow was really bad and it got very hot.  With the half helmet, the chin mitten would get totally messed and couldn't be trained back to anything like what I and wifey could accept.  Maybe I'll try again after September when the temperature and humidity drop back into merely hot rather than tropical levels.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Natedawg on August 10, 2012, 10:11:57 AM
Trimmed back to 1".  Too many complaints from the wife about the growth at 2".  It was looking pretty sloppy, no matter what.  Although I could use a hair dryer to get some of the waves under control, the minute I went out in the heat and humidity it was friz city. The other big issue was on the HD with the full helmet--the airflow was really bad and it got very hot.  With the half helmet, the chin mitten would get totally messed and couldn't be trained back to anything like what I and wifey could accept.  Maybe I'll try again after September when the temperature and humidity drop back into merely hot rather than tropical levels.

Quitter.   ;)

J/k, I feel your pain. I have to keep mine neutered to a certain degree as well. Not because my wife doesn't like it longer, but because it gets sloppy and erratic, similar to your predicament. I like it at somewhat-manageable levels.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: TheSlyBear on August 10, 2012, 11:23:43 AM
Mine is the same way, saintc. Anything longer than an inch and it starts doing weird Castro things.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on August 10, 2012, 02:32:50 PM
weird Castro things.

Yup, that's a good description ;D.  I wish I could get through the really rough stage so that the waves wouldn't look so bad, but peace in the household does have a price! 
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Razor X on August 10, 2012, 07:04:04 PM
Mine is the same way, saintc. Anything longer than an inch and it starts doing weird Castro things.

Mine starts growing sideways at about 1/2 inch. If I could hide from public view for a few months maybe I could find the perseverance to go longer.
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on August 10, 2012, 07:18:50 PM
. If I could hide from public view for a few months maybe I could find the perseverance to go longer.

Okay, good thought--SBG refuge in the South of France, good food, good wine, music--and let the face fur grow.  Okay-it's a totally imaginary idea. >:(
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Beardman on August 10, 2012, 07:41:16 PM
But not a bad one... I would want to go north for a truly Norse inspired beard though!
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: D.A.L.U.I. on August 10, 2012, 07:48:33 PM
But not a bad one... I would want to go north for a truly Norse inspired beard though!
Yeah, but even if Lutefisk may make the beard grow-- a nice red wine, olives, good cheese, and bread is better than the Norge diet, even though I grew up on a lot of that.  Sun and beard growth is better than ice and cold, IMHO.  But I'll never have the choice. 
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: Razor X on August 10, 2012, 08:14:52 PM
. If I could hide from public view for a few months maybe I could find the perseverance to go longer.

Okay, good thought--SBG refuge in the South of France, good food, good wine, music--and let the face fur grow.  Okay-it's a totally imaginary idea. >:(

If only!  ;)
Title: Re: Beard styles, who has what?
Post by: marshd1000 on August 15, 2012, 06:45:35 AM
Well, after a few months of having just a mustache and then the stache and Van Dyke, I am going full bearded again.  But right now it is just 3 days old.  But I am going to do a short beard for awhile as I may be making a job transition.  But that is another story!